The public opinion on EU-China trade relations is marked by skepticism and criticism of the EU's current strategies, revealing frustrations over its dependency on the U.S. while highlighting China's economic emergence. Commenters express urgency for a reevaluation of trade practices, advocating for a more balanced approach that considers China's influence alongside concerns about U.S. policy.

European Union

China

United States

How could Kosovo have US as the largest trading partner in 2000 when it didn't even exist at that point?

gmaaz

Services based economies export much less than manufacturing based economies. Shocking.

Archaemenes

I assume this is mainly tracking the expansion of Chinese consumer goods to more markets and not a reduction in trade with the US or EU.

Few-Addendum464

How is Syria’s largest trading partner is the EU when the country has been heavily sanctioned since the 1980-x? And basically under a total economic embargo for the last 15 years? If anything it should be China both years

waddah_j

UK is part of EU on 2000 map and on the 2024 it is not - correct, bravo! Then why are all 13 countries that became part of EU between 2000 and 2024 marked as part of EU on both?

It's like HALF of EU in number of countries and still quite significant part in terms of land area or population. Come on.

Such a lazy mapmaking.

piterfraszka

I wonder what effect Brexit had on this, the UK imports a hell of a lot of stuff and together in the EU it could have knocked the total higher than China.

saxonturner

uniyk

AniTaneen

USA took Jordan from EU 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸

OHHHHHSAYCANYOUSEEE

patoezequiel

Chance-Anxiety-1711

Huge_Friendship_6435

most overlooked thing is that the pie for everyone is expanding...

AspireFIRE

So tired of this map. Every week. Yes, the West willingly deindustrialized and outsourced everything as per progressive neoliberal economics. We know.

ToonMasterRace

Isn’t the EU about putting trade barriers on the outside to grow trade inside the common market?

KingKaiserW

China is agrarian. Urbanizing fast? You bet 'cha, but still agrarian.

VillainAnderson

cartman89405

outtokill7

It's crazy that in 2024 of the 2700 billion dollars exported by the EU, 1550 billion were exported by Germany. In 2000 it was only around 125 billion

Justeff83

Why were yemen oman so ride or die chinese 25 years ago?

call_me_pete_

so USA isnt the largest trading partners for many countries anymore but they are still growing in trade, just not as well as china

Fat_Blob_Kelly

It would be interesting to have an "other" category, if a country's primary trading partner was neither of the 3 shown.  E.g. I would guess that Cuba and Belarus trade more with Russia than with the EU

psymon1111

20/20 hindsight, but what if the US had proceeded with the Trans-Pacific Partnership?

RichardSwellington

qwerhpi

I see that China has done well in South America 🤔

Low_Ad8603

mapzlyinsights

America number 1 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🦅💪🏿

MiroHr

Kazakhstan is a big surprise as a neighbor of China and a relative pro-Russian country.

Erno-Berk

I mean what products truly made in the US would you even buy abroad?

Even the software like Windows is getting worse.

Additional-Hour6038

Lego_Laws

I had American computer Dell, it held up really nicely, fuck made in China products always breaks. After a year. When warranty expires.

NumerousCarob6

Why the hell is the EU's shade of blue used for US dominance while the US's shade of blue used for EU dominance?


The maker of this map is a monster, a laughing, playful, Chinese monster.

democritusparadise

Canada and Mexico are working overtime to diversify markets to get off the Yank teet.

Novel_Adeptness_3286

The EU has lost Russia and they're not getting that back ever even after the war ends. They've managed to drive Russia and China to their closest ever relations in 80 years in what is quite possibly the most baffling case of diplomatic short-sightedness this century.

refusenic

sirbruce

This map makes it look like US isn't losing to China, instead mainly Europe is losing to China while US keeps its position.

XSATCHELX

BeepBeep_Move

Colombian President Gustavo Petro just signed Colombia up with the Chinese.

BathSalt_Walt

Put3socks-in-it

It looks like the chosen ones are moving the money east leaving the us with nothing but a civil war

ramosoy182

billy-suttree

All empires crumble. The US is crumbling now and taking its allies down with it. China is rising.

ProfAsmani

China is still incredibly supportive of Russia, besides some economic agreements over trade I doubt the EU would be willing to partner with China over trying to build up its own power without Chinese or American involvement.

Military cooperation is out of the window with China as well due to China keeping Russia alive.

WalterWoodiaz

Unlikely.

Europe's main focus is the Ukraine-Russian war. China's support of Russia is going to weigh heavy in any relationship.

Economically it's a mismatch. Theyre both net exporters. 

Poltically Europe doesn't look kindly to authoritarian governments. 

Europe is more likely to look to be more self-sufficient. Relying on the US in the short term is too risky, but depending on China is worse for an indefinite amount of time.

Hailene2092

It would be possible if Europe accepted China's position on Taiwan and possibly other disputes in the SCS. However, if the two countries had an FTA, European manufacturing (or at least manufacturing in Europe) will be quickly hollowed out. All the remaining European proprietary technology will be stolen/copied, improved upon, and mass produced in China for a fraction of the price. However, this doesn't necessarily mean the end of the European economy. Chinese are huge consumers of European tourism, luxury brands, agricultural products, football, and education. Many Chinese will continue to immigrate to Europe for a superior quality of life. We hear of the German economy failing and the Chinese economy rising, but the number of Chinese in Germany is still far higher than vice versa for a reason. There are far more Chinese in Japan and South Korea than vice versa for the same reason as well, and they are still immigrating in significant numbers.

If Europe can accept an economically subservient relationship, it can work out. But remember that China at the end of the day is a nation that cannot be fully trusted, just like the US and Russia. There is a reason China is disliked and mistrusted by its neighbors, from Mongolia to Vietnam, regardless of their political or economic system. One day, Europe will get slapped in the face by China, but perhaps the slap it gets will be softer than the slaps China's neighbors regularly endure. Ultimately, only Europe can have its own best interests at heart.

Korece

China has not allies only temporary partners, asks the urss.

Europe is not an entity, is a mix of countries with different interest, some needs the eeuu protection, (near Russia), some want to break (France), some feels betrayed (Germany), other are puppets from eeuu (Italy) and others needs urgent investments (Spain).

This framework only can drive to mid way between both powers.

In addition, eeuu can push to break the ue and china can produce a hit of inflation and scarcity.

The best move from eu is increase the resilience before cold war 2.

Kili81

thats great. our hidden police station in western world could have done better job.

Deepfuckmango

The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

It is likely for closer cooperation, and it was today or yesterday when Xi spoke with von der Leyen.

But it is not going to be easy because if China stops exporting to US, some of the trade may be diverted to EU.

I think in the long run it is not just EU working closer with China but probably the rest of the world working closer, away from the US.  It may be the silver lining if it gets the rest of the world to cooperate better.

Swamivik

Look up the history of the "Great Game," England's primary objective was to forever prevent a direct economic corridor between Shanghai and Berlin.

The creation of such a corridor would spell the end of the British Maritime Empire.

To that effect, England and later the US (who could be argued to have inherited the British Empire after WW2) have done everything in their power to keep the Eurasian landmass unstable and chaotic.

China's Belt and Road Project (New Silk Road) is a threat to the current US Empire as it negates the power the US currently has due to its naval control of all the worlds key Maritime Shipping Routes.

So yes, if Europe was smart they would start working with China. Unfortunately, most Western European leaders still cling to the US like babies.

As we speak Europe is being looted by the US and being forced to fight its wars in Eurasia. China is offering mutually beneficial economic trade and the US offers inflation and never ending wars (which lead to "migrant crisis's Europeans love to cry about). Each year that goes by Europe's position to secure a good balance in a world where China is the dominant economic power diminishes.

StepAsideJunior

[deleted]

Not chinese, but european. I think the EU will trade more with China now but will stop short of any type of alliance.
 Too many unresolved issues surrounding Ukraine, Taiwan, and political systems.

Boru-264

Not just possible but probably necessary, at this point. Thanks USA!

cnio14

The EU is just as much a target of the CCP being an unrepentant economic scammer, liar, and thief. Whereas the US has had enough, the EU is still in a frog in a boiling pot still thinking of the situation. Add in the Ukraine war, the high price of cheap goods that could've been sourced elsewhere that they've paid is too much to make any cooperation meaningful.

The 20% Trump tariffs are nothing compared to what the CCP has been doing behind the scenes for decades. And whereas the trump tariffs are likely to get reduced or removed in near future, you can count on the CCP's unrepentant ways to continue till end of time.

Linny911

**NOTICE: See below for a copy of the original post in case it is edited or deleted.**

I apologize beforehand, I don’t know a lot of Chinese history and politics, so if something I say is horribly wrong or culturally unacceptable, it is not my intention and I apologize.

Now that USA is betraying both Europe and China, is there a possibility for Europeans/EU to work together more closely with China? Is there any way we could trade more openly, and form stronger bonds between the two? Maybe even an alliance? I have spoken to several of my European friends, and they all seem open to this. How do Chinese people feel about this?



*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/China) if you have any questions or concerns.*

AutoModerator

Being allies means military cooperation as well as deeply complementary trade. In this regard, the trade structure between China and Europe is not yet highly aligned, and military cooperation requires a longer-term foundation of trust. However, I believe that as long as Europe adopts a more pragmatic approach rather than one driven by ideology, China and Europe can absolutely become better trade partners for each other. From both a geopolitical perspective and the standpoint of free trade principles, there is no fundamental conflict between China and Europe. Ursula von der Leyen and Chinese Premier Li Qiang have just had a phone call, and I see this as a very good start.

Material-Bee-5813

Possible but also takes a bit of luck, openness from the CCP, even more narcissistic arrogance from Trump, and some more spine from the EU. 

Due to a multiple of factors (innate unconscious out group/in group racism, difference in values, decades of US smearing campaign, and China's own wolf warrior foreign policy and indifference toward Russia's invasion of Ukraine), its take a lot for Europeans to trust the Chinese (heck probably Asians in general). The CCP might really have to do some drastic changes in its foreign policy (applied more pressure on Russia, provide trade benefits for EU, increase manufacturing investment in EU, lower domestic censorship/allow more human rights) to curry favor with the EU. It also takes a lot for the Europeans to flip off on the Americans given the long history of cooperation and their dependent on the American market and defense. So it really take like an invasion and annexation of green land to maybe get the EU to turn on the Americans. And even then, I probably still see some countries in EU will still align themselves with the US lol. Finally, EU is not China or the US is a coalition of 20 something countries with different values and interests. And since of WWII, they basically quasivessel states to the US for defense so it's going to take A LOT for them to grow a spine to actually go against the US lol.

Pension-Helpful

Europe wants to use china as they did with us and russia before.


Hell no. We must boycott europe or also use them as they want to use us.

MMORPGnews

As a student from China and studying in EU right now I hope that China can connect with EU closer than before without doubt. But I think that the energy source from Russia and military power or other technology from US might be the limit. It is the problem that EU can handle with it if energy be restricted and there is higher tariffs?

Hwang_YEJI_1108

From a European perspective, somehow I've ended up here - possibly?

There are a lot of things in which Europe and China are aligned in terms of Climate change and climate action and free trade or global stability in a broad sense.

Potential problems:

* Europe promotes democratic values and will call out abuses, but in the end is pragmatic when it comes to China.
* China supported Russia when it first invaded Ukraine "no limits" to their commitment etc. There is war in Europe - this is intolerable. Although notably China has backed off from this.

Actual Problems:

* In the end China manufactures too much for the USA and Europe to absorb without displacing domestic industry. China has to know it isn't practical or pragmatic for Europe to let this happen, so Europe will have to likely raise tariffs against China to stop dumping displaced US product soon.

Healthy-Drink421

Perhaps, but only if Europeans give up their unrealistic illusions about the United States and turn completely anti-American.

OneNectarine1545

Europe trade deficit will balloon, and same issue again.

azgecko

Yes this is what many business leaders foresaw happening even before the tariffs, especially with trade. People saying no because of Russia don’t know what they are talking about

shanghai-blonde

It would be a good idea for Europe to see off Trump, but when have European politicians ever done what was good for their people

RaeseneAndu

That's not a question for the Chinese.  When Merkel ran Germany China pulled out all the stops to woo Europe, promoting free and cooperative trade as part of Belt and Road.  Merkel reciprocated because she knew Germany benefitted tremendously from trade and cooperation with China but once Merkel left office, the American stooges in Europe took over Germany and the EU and decided they are willing to sacrifice their own obvious well being on the altar of American hypocr....uh, I mean freedom, democracy and the American way blah blah.  They turned up their noses on China, going even as far as threatening to enlarge NATO's sphere of activity to support the U.S. in deterring China in the South China Sea and Taiwan Straits.  Having been rebuffed a few times by the rude, short sighted and potentially traitorous (or unbelievably stupid) European leaders the Chinese no longer hold out hope for Europe.  They would welcome economic cooperation with Europe but they're not holding their breath, given how the same CIA compromised leaders still run Europe, even as they have to make angry noises w.r.t. the Trump tariffs and Russian overture to satisfy their outraged constituents.

asnbud01

Aromatic_Theme2085

The ball is in EU court. China is happy to do business with anyone.

Low_M_H

I am surprised to see how many people still think Russia is a huge factor to consider. The fact is, economically, Russia really does not matter that much to both EU and China, and it's not even on Trump's list.

Ettttt

Maybe, seems like a good move, but the party doesn’t seems to be very interested in it, pivot to Europe would piss off Russia, and Russia is now basically a economic colony of China, so there’s some risk here.

JackReedTheSyndie

Don’t think this is a question for china, it’s more a question to Europe - now America is unreliable, would you be more open to trade with another country that has a different culture and doesn’t necessarily has the same ideology

Fickle_Run_2294

No always friends,only unite for interests

Nearby-Simple-8368

Probably not.  I mean..Europe's more protective of trade than the US normally is and are pretty pissed at Russia.  I think China and Russia are basically banking on the fact that no one wants to push it to a nuclear level...so they'll invade and take as much as they can then say "back off or we blow it all up".

deadbeatmac

China will work with Russia and Iran not with EU.

1baruch

Difficult, if Chinese products can't go to the US, they will probably be dumped into Euro market and that's not what  Europe wants. 
It could actually trigger a tarrif war between both, EU was already considered (or they enacted, forgot now due to the current madness) measures against some Chinese imports such as EV cars, which China didn't like and treated to retaliate, so unless China totally changes its approach towards Europe (which they cant, they have to export somewhere) then I don't see how it can happen. China needs also to buy more Euro products but can't, Chinese domestic market isn't even able to made up for the loss of US market. 

This without talking about Russia &amp; security. China isn't seen as an opportunity in Europe anymore. How both sides could work together to establish a new and healthier relationship is an open question (albeit there are certainly some talks underway)

KindergartenDJ

It’s the choice of Europe, but seeing what happened in France and Romania it’s dubious if you even got the real choice your so proud off.

CreepyDepartment5509

No. Europe as a whole, still believes that they can be the equal to the US on their own. Whatever collab with China is going to be temporary until the US is off their neck again.

TheSuperContributor

Considering Russia is the bogeyman for Europe, it's unlikely to go future than trade agreements unless China breaks ties with Russia.

No_Equal_9074

Speaking from Australia, China are no better than the US. They blocked our exports when we called for an independent COVID inquiry, a severe breach of WTO rules. They are not multilateral, they are not rules based, don’t be fooled.

Zealousideal_Rub6758

Political affiliations aside, when China wants to initiate commerce with a country, the bargain is hard and disadvantageous to the other country. 

For example, if they use warehouses for shipping products, they don't follow the local workplace laws but their own. Different working hours, minimal workplace safety etc. They buy property as foreign individuals under favourable laws for individuals and they operate it via their business. They sign contracts for infrastructure but they use the lowest denominator in materials, against the local laws (see all the stadiums and roads that collapse). Working with China sounds cool until your car falls into a crater hole in the middle of the street or until the stadium arena collapses on championship day.

China tried to collaborate with Europe in the late 90s early 00's but it didn't work because their contractor tactics were too aggressive. France, Germany and Netherlands would never allow someone as aggressive as them in the building.

Also, China usually goes for countries that need cash and are willing to pay their first-borns for a casino building.

This policy is nothing new, but the quality of infrastructure and product materials (fabric etc) is extremely low. Even clothes don't last for more than 5 washes, let's forget about hammers made with soft metal or coffee makers which get short-circuited within months of purchase. China used to make quality products for sale, but now they are absolutely cheap, even when they cost a lot.

Other countries used to follow the same cut-throat international commerce policy, but at least you bought a refrigerator than lasted you 15 years and your metal tools could be used on metal without curving or tearing.

Jazzlike-Syrup511

'Betraying' is a loaded word. 

The EU is filled with NATO states that never paid the defense they agreed to.

China agreed to purchase things in Trump's first term that they never completed. They also have tariffs and outright ban companies like Google.

It's maybe a dick move (which is debatable) but it's certainly not 'betrayal'.

DeathChasesMe

Why would Europe get bound to its enemy, you are delusional.
China is 100% behind Russia, they even have soldiers fighting for Russia against Ukraine.

ThaiFoodYes

In most of Europe we don’t want this. Trade and cooperation has been used to bully and threaten Europe numerous times, and China is the very reason that Russia has been able to maintain the war effort in Ukraine - not just circumventing sanctions and delivering technology for the Russian weapons industry, it goes much further than that - and the significant support from North Korea only happens with Beijings approval. China is not an alternative for Europe, those days are long past, but China can be used to strategically outmaneuver Trump

alex3494

EU companies already offshored most manufacturing to China, so they could potentially offshore all of the rest, but this would not be very popular with European voters.


Apart from that, EU countries are democracies, and China is a fascist dictatorship, so it's not a very good match. India, Brasil or Indonesia would be better partners for the EU, out of the world's empires.

Born-Requirement2128

Time for Eurasia to unite. We can then ignore the US.

CleanMyAxe

They’re building a high speed rail from Beijing to Berlin

ManasZankhana

If you think the us is who you need to worry about, you know nothing about geopolitics. Who is gonna be shoving it's dick up your ass in the coming decades is china.

dupe123

China sees itself as the Middle Kingdom- below heaven but above anyone else. On that alone it is impossible to treat with china long term. They are also emerging from a century long embarrassment and do not seek simple equality in relations with the west and other powers- they seek to exercise dominance to erase a shame and demand fear. China does not respect modern neoliberal personal freedoms nor democratic principles. The Han Chinese are a monolith culture that does not respect diversity. 

Do business, sure, for a while money may talk l, but do not believe for a moment that china is a long term ally.

PM_ME_YOUR_URETHERA

We have always welcomed anyone and everyone who is open to cooperation.

We also have zero tolerance on western bullshit extremism and their hypocritical morality lies. Keep that shit in your backyard and we are good to go.

Fluffy-Climate-8163

Europe is USA’s lapdog. Europe will just do what they always do. Try to rough it out until USA gets back together. Europe won’t trust China.

Little_Drive_6042

China and Canada are cooperating too.

Canada is sending more oil to China.

KeiFeR123

I think first of all get rid of pakistan and russia friendly murmurs maybe then it can  happen , also I think cpc should just hold elections at this point with proper way ,they've done such great work so I'm pretty sure citizens would vote for them.

No, the EU needs to protect whatever industry it has left, whether it be chemicals, cars, high tech, or other sectors. China has been eating Europe's lunch. Low domestic consumption means China must sell its products overseas or shut down factories. If they can't sell to the Americans, they will try to dump everything to the EU, which will destroy industries in the EU.

prolongedsunlight

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DeltaBot

how about they just stay neutral and let US and China be at each others throats? 

whats the issue of being on neutral terms with China?

ProDavid_

Perhaps the easiest way to change your mind is to point out how China has already burned a number of bridges with Europe by allegedly taking key technology and then using government subsidies to push EU firms out of the market.  An EU company comes in to make, say, wind turbines and suddenly the technology that was shared with the JV is being used to for domestic production that forces the EU firm out of the market.

A second concern is that China is not a democracy but rather an autocratic regime that does not necessarily align with EU values.  As an American, I would point out that the US has long set aside its morals (at least the ones we pretend to have) to prop up regimes that brought us economic value.  I think you could argue that getting in bed with dictatorships creates some long term issues to include potentially exposing the EU to internal corruption.  I mean, Russia was extremely cozy (and still is) with a number of EU politicians which in turn hampers the EU's ability to present a unified front against Russian expansionism.

That's not to say that the EU shouldn't consider some trade and collaboration options with the China, but it might want to be careful not to create a new set of problems.

chotchss

China wields its economy like a knife to influence foreign policy and attitudes worldwide. Why do you think even the NBA in America bends itself over backwards to force athletes to apologize if they say anything that could be vaguely construed as antiChinese? It's because China plausibly threatens to cut off the NBA from the Chinese market. They'll happily loan third-world countries money - but only with extortionate, colonial-style long-term leases on critical infrastructure that grant them direct power over your ability to conduct commerce.

Deliberately tying yourself to them further only allows them to exert more power over you. They're infinitely more manipulative than America with this, since they have top-down control over their economy and dictatorial control over their government. If Xi decides you won't do business in China, you're cut off overnight with no process.

Worse yet, China is about to fall off a demographic cliff in a few decades. The short-term gains you make economically are going to be offset and undercut by the strategic changes they impose on you, and then they'll fall off the world stage as even a potential superpower as their economy, military, and influence harshly contract as their population collapses. You'll have given them unfettered access to your economy for nothing in the long term.

This is worse than cutting off your nose to spite your face, this is sabotaging your country as well.

xfvh

&gt;Let’s talk about the unpredictability of U.S. trade policies under Trump. The U.S. has shown time and again that it can pivot on a dime when it comes to international relations—whether it’s pulling out of trade deals or slapping tariffs on allies. 

Any trade unpredictability under the current US administration is 10 times worse under the Chinese Communist Party. A prime example of this was during the Covid-19 Pandemic, where the Australian Prime minister called for an independent investigation into the origins of the Covid-19 outbreak. This is a totally reasonable request, and independent investigations are one of the core values of open and free democracies like those in the EU. Do you know what the Chinese response to this was? A 200% tariff on Australian wine, which killed our wine industry stone cold dead. We went from selling $1.2 Billion dollars of wine to China to less than $1 million. The equivalent of a multibillion dollar temper tantrum.

China has done the same to Japan, where they have banned critical mineral exports over a geopolitical dispute.

China is extremely mercantilists in its economic policy, as its business are tightly controlled by the state. China engages in many economic practices that are designed to damage foreign economies and production to increase Chinas power. These include IP theft and dumping cheap product on the market to close down factories. There is a reason that Chinese companies like Huawei is banned all over the western world. Because they cannot be trusted and are essentially a commercial entity of the CCP and their foreign policy goals.

  
My point is that currently the US may be bad and unpredictable, but that does not make China a better choice. In my opinion, the EU needs to look inward and grow its own industrial and production capacity in order to become powerful enough to deal with Russia on their own. This will not happen if the EU just opens themselves up to cheap Chinese goods that will simply end in the shutting of factories

jp72423

Hitching your wagon to a genocidal dictatorship that's gearing up to go to war and is obviously leveraging economic policies to weaken their enemies, control weaker countries and consolidate their own power is fucking dumb regardless of what Trump and the US are doing. 

Things will be more stable with China sure, but it wouldn't be good, in the end China would end up owning you, again it'd be stable, you'd be stable slave countries.

FuturelessSociety

Have you considered cutting off your nose to spite your face? That would be less damaging to the EU in the long term than strengthening an axis power of the globe.

SilenceDobad76

Tension in EU-China trade relations is highlighted by an upcoming summit amid rising conflicts over tariffs and trade practices.

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